OYP Episode 20: Sabrina McPherson

Sabrina McPherson, Managing Director and Co-Leader of Management Consulting for North America at Publicis Sapient, talks about how critical self-evaluation of your own strengths and growth areas helps inform calculated risk taking in your career journey, as well as the importance of coaching culture in strong, growth oriented teams.

Interview

Peter Szczerba - Welcome back to the Own Your Potential Podcast, where you'll hear stories from leaders across the globe about how they've taken control of their career growth and lessons on how you can too. I'm Peter Szczerba. And today I'm speaking to Sabrina McPherson, who's a Managing Director at Publicis Sapient. Sabrina excited to have you on the podcast today. Let's just jump right in. Why don't you start by telling us a little bit about your career journey so far?

Sabrina McPherson - Sure. So I'm coming out of school where in my undergrad I studied economics, Business Economics and computer science, I actually joined internal sort of Business Strategy Team at Disney, and did a corporate role there for two years before pursuing my master's degree in economics. And after my master's program is when I made the jump into consulting. So really, for the last 20 years or so I have been what I what I'd call a career consultant. And I joined a firm called Marakon, which is a boutique strategy house where I really got the opportunity to focus on helping companies really drive growth and a value driven approach to growth. And then from that role, I kind of stayed there all the way and made it to partner and then made the jump over here to Sapient.

Peter Szczerba - Sabrina, that's a really interesting journey. And you spent a lot of time at your previous firm. I wonder what compelled you to make such a major pivot over to Publicis Sapient? And I guess, what are some of the challenges you faced internally in making that decision?

Sabrina McPherson - Yeah, that's a great question. Because it was something that was really unexpected. So I had been in America for about 15 years, and I wasn't looking to make a jump, I was very happy, they're comfortable there. It was, you know, a great company. And really what piqued my interest about this opportunity was the opportunity that was given at Sapient was to really come over and be one of the first hires to build a new management consulting practice. And so it was something completely, you know, outside of what I had prior experience with, and that it was entrepreneurial. But what was great about it, it was kind of a combination of a risk that for me, being a risk averse person, it was something that provided new risk and opportunity, but still had enough comfort for me in in things that I knew that I feel like I felt like it would be a good combination of me being able to provide value very fast. But additionally, me going somewhere where I would be getting value for myself as well. And I think getting that combination of value exchange, and whatever the next move was in my career was really important. And so that was kind of the decision making process I went through, I was saying, Okay, I'm willing to take a risk and jump ship and build something brand new, and a company that I know nothing about in a space that's, you know, tangential to where I'm in. But it's not so far out of my profile. I know very fast, how I can add value, but I also see all the value I can get from this new opportunity.

Peter Szczerba - So that's really interesting, Sabrina, and making that sort of leap and taking that sort of risk that takes a lot of critical evaluation of your skills, like what are your strengths? Where are you hoping to grow? And is that next opportunity going to offer you those opportunities to grow? And I think that's a really important part of self advocacy. And I'm curious Sabrina, do you have tactics that you think were really successful for you that helps you do that?

Sabrina McPherson - Yeah, no, I mean, I do think you touched on a key part about self advocacy, which is really getting clear on what you as a person needs, what you know, what you're good at, and therefore what the gaps are, right? And having clarity then around saying, okay, based on what those gaps are, you know, what resources do I have at my disposal, whether those are people or content, knowledge, any resources really on helping you to start to fill those gaps and surrounding yourself with those resources that can help that. And I think through this process, when I was looking, you know, all of a sudden, when my interest got piqued on this new opportunity with CPA, I it helped me actually realize even more and more one of the key gaps that I had, which was really having the depth in digital technology. And that's an area that I just didn't have and was going to be increasingly relevant in, obviously, today's world. And so that was a big part of why I made the jump because I was able to identify and say, Well, look, you know, this is the main gap for me, and this opportunity is really one that can help me bridge that gap. But additionally, you know, allow me to leverage the strengths that I've built over my 20 year career before coming here. So it's that perfect combo of both because you don't really want to, you know, it's really hard to drive, Self Advocacy. If you're in a position where you feel like you're unable to know how you can add value in the first place, right? It's really a given take around where you can add value, but additionally, where you still have outstanding gaps.

Peter Szczerba - That's really interesting, Sabrina. So coming from an extensive career journey in the world of management consulting, where the behaviors around self advocacy and self promotion are definitely more celebrated and ingrained in the culture of those types of organizations. How do you find now that sort of behavior being received at Publicis Sapient? In this new type of organization? And how do you think you can help challenge the social perception around these sorts of behaviors that are so critical to growth?

Sabrina McPherson - Yeah, so it's a good question, because I, because I had prior to coming here, and my whole experience was within a management consulting firm, I didn't realize that that isn't the norm. I'll be totally honest about that. Because the growth mindset and self advocacy is something that is just expected and kind of status quo normal in the industry, and then coming over and building this practice here in sapient. has allowed me to see that it is it there are some contrasts with that mindset and sort of what exists in the organization today. And I think, for me, it's even surprising, frankly, to hear you say that there would be some criticism of that kind of behavior, because it's the opposite, right? We see that within our you know, my practice and management consulting, and in our discipline is something it's really one of the core strengths and cultural development strengths that we offer, which is really everyone that sort of in our practice, they own their career progression, right? It's a proactive career progression. And part of that self advocacy is core to basically being the owner of your own development.

Peter Szczerba - Sabrina, how do you think the strong culture of coaching within management consulting firms can be translated to an organization like Publicis Sapient or others maybe, where the behaviors of self advocacy have a stigma in order to leverage advocacy for others as a way to strengthen self advocacy behaviors.

Sabrina McPherson - In our business, in particular, and many others, it's really an apprenticeship business. So that coaching role, both formal and informal is just really, really critical to progressing. And so it really plays naturally into self advocacy for oneself and for others, because you're really learning on the job on how to get the job through coaching. You know, our business is about talent, right? We don't make a product, we we sell talent, to companies to help companies drive change. And so our asset is our people. And therefore we're investing in coaching and developing them and helping them develop and others and pass it on, because that's basically our product that we're selling, right. So it's almost just natural, and specifically consulting, right, because you're basically grooming the next tier of sort of the product that you are then selling to your clients. And in doing that, it's basically a reinforcing loop around that self advocacy for oneself and advocacy for others.

Peter Szczerba - I really liked that. And that's a really strong sentiment that I think a lot of people need to take to heart Sabrina around owning their own career progression, I do want to touch back on something you mentioned around being in the business of our people and our talent being our product, as opposed to an actual product. That is the technology or otherwise. And in that sort of space, an individual's personal brand is that much more important and tied to their success. So I wonder Sabrina, maybe in three words, we'd love to hear a little bit about what you think your brand is.

Sabrina McPherson - Sure. So I would say the first word is a doer, people who know me know that I just get stuff done. And they can always count on me to deliver. The second one is direct. So I'm very, very direct, and sometimes to a fault with my communication. And so something I'm also working on is making sure that I can smooth the edges a little bit on my communication. And then lastly, I'm definitely very passionate about clients about helping to solve their problems about developing that next next level of talent. And so, you know, passion brings emotion and excitement. And that can be positive or negative. And so I think those are, those are three things that most folks that have worked with me would say, are my brand.

Peter Szczerba - Sabrina, I want to dive a little bit further into this idea of coaching and the important role that a coach plays but also the the role of the individual to really take control of their career progression and adopt that strong growth mindset. Can you tell me a little bit about your thoughts on that area?

Sabrina McPherson - Yeah, sure. So I think I feel very strongly about this. And I think coaching is yes, in theory, a two way street, right? The coach has to do their job and be a good coach, and so does the coachee. But really, I think it really falls in to the lap of the coachee. So what I mean there is that really, an individual has to take ownership for their progression for their development. It's no one else's job but one's own job right one's own mandate to drive their own career, I think a lot of times we see folks, especially younger folks that are new in their career waiting for, you know, someone else to tell them what they should be developing and someone else to take their, their career under, you know, their wing to guide them. And yes, of course, there are going to be mentors out there. But even finding a mentor in itself is one being proactive about their career, right. So finding if one self is unhappy with what their career scenario is, is up to them to change it right and up to them to identify gaps and fill them. And so I think starting you know, self advocacy in itself, and, and growth mindset in itself, really, to me mean that, you know, your career development is 100% up to you. And an individual needs to really take control of it proactively and drive it.

Peter Szczerba - Sabrina really want to thank you for taking the time and sharing a little bit of your story and your perspective. It's incredibly valuable, and I'm sure it's going to inspire a lot of people. So thank you.

Sabrina McPherson - Thanks so much for having me.