OYP Episode 30: Taylor Frey & Rachel Adams

Taylor Frey, Manager Data Science & Analytics, & Rachel Adams, Senior Associate Project Management, two future leaders at Publicis Sapient tell us about how understanding the big picture and developing a diverse, cross functional knowledge base and perspective early in your career are critical to building a solid foundation for future success.

Interview

 Peter Szczerba - Welcome back to the Own Your Potential Podcast, where you'll hear stories from leaders across the globe about how they've taken control of their career growth and lessons on how you can to. I'm Peter Szczerba. And today I have the pleasure of talking to two superstars from coast to sapient. Taylor Frey, Manager of Data Science and Analytics, and Rachel Adams, Senior Associate of Program Management. Taylor, Rachel, really excited to have you guys on today. Let's just jump right into it. Can you tell us a little bit about your career journeys so far?

Rachel Adams - Sure, I can get us started. My name is Rachel, I am a senior associate in the Agile Program Management craft here at Publicis Sapient in Toronto. I've been here for almost four years now. And prior to PS, I was working at a very small content marketing agency. I graduated from Queen's University with a Bachelor of Commerce. So definitely have a background in marketing and statistics. And it's been really exciting to see that at play here at Publicis Sapient. And right now I'm working in the telco media and technology vertical.

Taylor Frey - And I'm Taylor, I started at Publicis Sapient, about four and a half years ago, as a new grad fresh out of school. And I'm currently a Manager on the Data Science and Analytics team. Also in Toronto, I've had the opportunity to work on a couple different clients. And I'm also heavily involved in the Toronto office culture. I graduated from the University of Waterloo with a bachelor of mathematics and business specialization. But I was also in a co op program and had a bunch of different internships along the way.

Peter Szczerba - Very cool. And I think I have a ton of context on this that's unique, because I've had the unique pleasure of watching both of you come in at the junior associate level and kind of grow and develop and really, exponentially increase your impact with every passing month and year at Publicis Sapient. And so I'm curious, tell me about some of the things that you guys have done that have been over and above your regular day to day roles that have helped you take control of your your careers and your career growth?

Taylor Frey - Yeah, I think go first, I've always been someone that puts their full weight into everything they do, I definitely can't half ass anything. And I think that mindset carries into my career. So I've definitely, since I started as a junior, and I think more recently, I've had to take control of that growth for myself, because I felt like I had finished and gone through that new grad stage, where transitioning away from being a student and just learning how to be an adult. I started by saying yes to every single opportunity that was presented in front of me, which meant that I was drinking from a firehose along the way. But then I really found myself kind of getting over that hump getting more comfortable. And so I was searching and trying to figure out what was next. There's so much information out there. And it's really overwhelming, and really hard to decide what would be most valuable. I was trying to learn about other perspectives that would allow me to get out of the data space and think beyond that and see the bigger picture, the challenges that our clients are facing and that are having day to day, they're not isolated to a single department. And so I was asking myself, why am I just thinking about data? Why am I thinking about this in a silo? And then it turns out that Rachel was having the same thoughts. And we figured that there were others out there like us. So when we couldn't figure out what that next step was, or what that learning program was, like, we decided to create our own. And so we created this pilot program called PS University.

Rachel Adams - And so I can jump in here and maybe just give a little bit more detail into what what that is. So, PSU Publicis Sapient University. It's a cross discipline learning program. It's 16 weeks long, it combines individual and group learning. And it's really targeted at manager level, folks and below here, we spend two to three weeks learning about data learning about engineering, experience, program and product management. And then of course, we also add some diversity and inclusion practices. It was built loosely off of a program we have here at Publicis Sapient called the fellowship in transformation leadership, which is like an executive MBA and really targeted to more senior leadership. Unfortunately, it is for more senior leadership. And we felt like there was a gap again, with Junior knowledge and that cross discipline learning that Taylor just mentioned, that we thought, you know, why not just build our own program? So we're really trying to build multi dimensional leaders, future leaders of our company that can speak to issues, challenges, opportunities, etc, beyond just the account work that they do and the clients that they work with or within their own domain. And we're in the process of piloting it right now with about 60 people in Toronto. So it's super, super exciting.

Peter Szczerba - So I mean, I've seen this go and evolve from an idea into something real concrete and tangible. And it's about to finish in terms of its pilot. And I'm really excited to see what this has turned into. And I want you guys to talk a little bit about, you know, the fact that you essentially replicated something that was targeted more at senior leaders to develop them even further in their leadership journeys in organization for a very select few, then you've kind of combined this idea of almost like a rotational program that a lot of new grad, get to experience at other organizations. And really, you built that from scratch you, you know, you took content, you created it, you solicited senior stakeholders to kind of champion this and help bring it to life. Talk about all of the effort, forget the experience of actually participating in it and seeing folks benefit from it that you know, and yourselves benefit from it by by being in it. But to stand this up, talk about what that has done to open your eyes, about what it takes to really build something and take control of your career growth, your potential and provide that same opportunity for others.

Rachel Adams - Well, I think the positive learning for both of us in this experience has been if you see a gap in your organization, and certainly in our organization, there's always an opportunity to strike out and do your own thing. Everyone is super supportive here. So in building the program, we got to work with a lot of different people. Every time we talk to someone new, they refer us to someone else to someone else, et cetera, et cetera. So we got to talk and learn from quite a number of folks, and at no point where we met with objections, everyone was so supportive, provided great feedback and great guidance. So that was super helpful, just from a mentorship perspective. And certainly, Peter having you know, your support, as well, as you know, Kate Turner support was super incredible for us, and really helped us draft this this program. But I think on an even more tactical level, it was a lot of work. I mean, certainly there were many nights that Taylor and I were reviewing content, reading articles, sharing things back and forth, setting up reviews, talking to leadership. And so certainly it was a lot of effort. But I think we're we're really feeling that it's paid off. And it's been super rewarding.

Taylor Frey - And I think I would just add that, as much as it's been super challenging to balance our day to day work. And do all of this on top of everything it's been, it's been worth it, because we've been able to go through all of this content and learn it ourselves. And so we're able to approach the challenges that we have in our current jobs differently, just because we've been kind of behind the scenes learning about all of these different areas of the organization. As someone that's been here for almost five years, I thought that I knew all of these different teams and what they were doing and all of these great people, but every single person that we continue to talk to, there's a new area of the business that that I can consider and can help me do my job better. So that's been really nice to see. But that doesn't mean that we didn't have a lot of challenges along the way. I mean, we launched this in 2020, we launched it, and we had to quickly shift and make it remote, which was challenging. And then I think the only one of the other big challenges that we faced was trying to get the more junior employees, we said it was manager and below to see the point of all of this content, we weren't trying to build people, we weren't trying to build the content for people to switch jobs. So if I'm in data, I wasn't trying to build the content to switch and become a developer was really trying to find that right balance of the depth of becoming aware of other disciplines and other teams and how they function but giving them that knowledge to be able to work with them better.

Peter Szczerba - I want to dig into that a little bit because you guys have both consumed all the content from the perspective of standing this program up and making sure that the content was appropriate, potentially valuable and easy to understand and retain etc. But then you've also essentially have participated in it as it's been delivered. And I'm curious, do you feel like in this kind of MVP 1 of this of this program that you guys have sent successfully struck that balance? Do you find that it has broadened your holistic understanding of digital business transformation and how we are solving for that with our various disciplines and crafts?

Rachel Adams - I definitely think so. Certainly for me as a program manager ideal more on the client sort of business of things. So be to be able to dive a bit more deeply into data and engineering and technology has been really beneficial. For me. Certainly.

Taylor Frey - I think on my side, it has been definitely helpful. I think I'm on the other side of Rachel in the data space and have a little bit more technology, background and experience. So getting the knowledge of when we're selling work, when we're managing work and managing teams and the different processes of that. And just thinking about it from an account or a revenue side, all of these different pieces, have opened my mind up when I'm on new accounts now. And it's like, Oh, I wish I knew this before. I wish other people knew this.

Rachel Adams - And if I could just add one more point to that. Sorry, Peter. Um, I think that the beauty is that it's also shown me what I have a deeper interest in wanting to dig into, for example, I've always known that I love data, and the analytics team is so strong here. But doing some of these readings, some of these courses has just furthered that. And I know, I definitely want to take that to the next level, and certainly will be pursuing some learning beyond what was part of PSU. So I think it's been really helpful to highlight areas where I want to dig in more deeply in my own kind of personal career growth as well.

Peter Szczerba - See, that's what particularly excites me is that, you know, a program like this targeted at people relatively early in their career, maybe just starting their careers, likely, there's a chance that some of the folks participating may be just through this platform, discovering what exactly it is that they really, really want to do. Maybe to your point, Rachel, it's it's you start out as a PM, you end up being a data driven PM, leveraging some advanced techniques, or you actually pivot to the to the data, practice down the line, not saying that you would, although we would welcome you. But I think that's a really interesting opportunity that you guys present for folks through this as well. But I mean, over and above PSU, as incredible of an achievement as it is, and I really celebrate you guys for making this happen. I'm, I'm curious. And because I know, you guys are involved in so much more, give me some other examples of stuff that you guys have done to grow your network to grow the optics around everything that you're doing, and the impact you're having through some of the extra curricular things that you guys are involved in. And just give me some examples of that.

Taylor Frey - Yeah, I can go first. Um, one of the first things that I did when I joined Publicis Sapient, was joining Toastmasters, and was really trying to refine my public speaking skills, which helped grow that competence and build it from a student that had very rarely given presentations given that I was in bachelor mathematics. But in addition to just becoming a better speaker, I found it really helped me learn how to listen and provide meaningful feedback. I also joined our Women's Leadership Network team. And that developed a passion for me in supporting young women starting their career. So I come from a stem background. So I'm used to being one of the only women in the room, but I'm really trying to change that. So I've been one of the or I've become one of the Women's Leadership Network leads, in addition to Rachel and we've built programs and initiatives dedicated to bringing in more women into PS and inspiring more young women to pursue a career in technology.

Rachel Adams - Yes, and for myself, very similar to Taylor, you know, the Women's Leadership Network is something that I'm very passionate about and hope to continue to be involved with in the future, and was definitely one of the first things I wanted to get involved with. When joining PS, I am also really involved with our Toronto culture. So you know, social events, all that fun stuff. But beyond that, I'm also very deeply ingrained into the telco media and technology vertical, so I help run the continuous learning initiative, as well as the product craft within TMT as well which has been such a great opportunity not only for my own learning to help better understand the role of product as it relates to our clients in TMT, but to also just build valuable relationships with people that I can call on or count on when I have questions or I'm not sure about the best path, and has really provided me with with valuable mentors for now when hopefully, deeply into my career. And so really have just been trying to scatter interest and time across, you know, culture events that really boost the morale of our people, but also industry knowledge, and discipline, knowledge for my own my own benefit, too.

Peter Szczerba – To be honest with you all this sounds incredibly exhausting, right, like Women's Leadership Network, the initiatives that go with that, PSU, as the people who thought of it and, you know, forced it to come to life because it was absolutely necessary in the organization and everything else around your professional development that you're taking into your hands. How you keep going, like explain how you stay motivated to keep doing this.

Rachel Adams - I can go first on that one. Um, I think that for me I really live by the philosophy of, you know, if you're not learning, you're not growing. And I have such an insatiable curiosity and a desire to kind of live to my fullest potential that I feel like if I'm not doing this, I'm not realizing that goal and that vision for myself. So there's just this relentless drive, I think that always has me, you know, coming back. And I think that there's so much reward with everything that we've done, even though Yes, it sounds like a lot of work. And certainly, there's been weeks where we've had to put in extra hours, the impact that I feel we've been able to make, and the benefit I've received personally, whether that's through relationships or recognition has been so so worth it, that, you know, it's not even a question in my mind to raise my hand to volunteer for other opportunities that come up in the future.

Taylor Frey - And I think I think I'm the same, the it has to be worth it, the impact has to be there, if we didn't enjoy it, and we weren't seeing the value that it's bringing people. I'm sure I could find other things, other things to spend my time on. But I kind of tell myself that when I was in school, and when I was growing up, I wanted programs like the ones that we're creating. And so telling myself that there's other people coming behind me in this world that can benefit from these types of programs and initiatives is worth it. But then I also think in terms of a more short term, I really find that I need to prioritize my time. And having to choose means that I'm prioritizing the things that are driving the most impact for me and for others.

Peter Szczerba - So I love exploring this idea of prioritization, because I've recently heard a quote that I'm going to adopt into my lexicon going forward. And it's the idea of dispassionately prioritizing your passions, and taking a really benefit and cost kind of approach to looking at your passions, whether professional or otherwise, and just figuring out what can I fit into the day and what's going to be most impactful and what's most important to me. And so I love that you talk about that, because I think that's a really important skill for people to figure out as they take on all of these types of activities and initiatives as you guys have to try and further their growth, or their their brand, their careers. But then at the same time, you have crazy people like you two getting involved in all these things. And specifically, Rachel, I want to talk about you and I know, Taylor, you are an insatiable reader as well. But didn't you read like 100 plus books this year, Rachel, or this past year?

Rachel Adams - Yes, I did. I love to read. But I mean, I think I mean, just to touch on that. I think that programs like PSU and other people that were exposed to as part of our organization have taught me that there's so much value in reading when you're interested in something. And I've learned so much from the books that I've read. And to be clear, you know, I read everything from crappy fiction all the way through to really interesting business and marketing strategy books. And I think that there's always an opportunity to be learning and so I, I can't read fast enough, I should say, I wish I could read faster, so that I could take in even more, because it's so invaluable to my personal brand, but also to my personal learning.

Peter Szczerba - From there, I want to I want to pivot a little bit and just talk about, you know, one of two things. And I think I'll leave it to both of you to think about which one you want to answer. But really, it's about what what in your mind, are you guys building towards with all of this because you both, you know, your delivery and the quality of your work and client impact is second to none. And then on top of all this all that you have all this cultural impact personal development, professional development. I'm curious, what are you building towards? What do you envision yourself as down the line, right? Is it senior leadership? Or is it less about kind of what you achieve from a professional growth standpoint and more about kind of the legacy you leave behind? Because I know for some people, that's a really important thing. So, you know, Taylor, why don't you kick it off and kind of tell us, what are you building all this towards?

Taylor Frey - That's a good question. Some days, I'm asking myself where the answer, but I think for me, it's about the team that I'm building for me to be on and hopefully lead in the future. I look around at the data team that I'm on right now, there's not that many females, and it's not as diverse as it could be. And so a lot of the stem and Women's Leadership Network initiatives are trying to get towards building a more diverse set of teams. But then I think On the flip side, it's what type of skills and knowledge am I building along the way for myself and for my teammates, because we've seen people and research shows that diverse teams are the way to have a better business, create a better solution, make a better product, and having the knowledge and the skill set to, to have that perspective and to bring more people together as I think what I'm doing all of this for.

Rachel Adams - And I certainly have, you know, many aspirations, I think, Peter, I really liked that you touched upon the idea of legacy versus a specific role. I think that at the end of the day, what's most important is that, you know, I want to be remembered as a compassionate leader who empowered everyone on her team, you know, no matter their level, their background, their role. But I think on a very tactical level, I'm you know, I'm coming for Sheldon Monteros job. He's our Chief Product Officer. And I think that the sky is really the limit if you're hungry, and ambitious and driven, and you treat everything, including the challenges that you encounter as opportunities. And so I'm, I hope to continue to be driven and ambitious and work towards that convergence of a product mindset with program management, and you know, one day be leading the space in our organization.

Peter Szczerba - So I absolutely love both of those answers. And I love that they're honest, that they're ambitious. And they are transparent, and candid. And I think that's important. It's not about putting limits on what you can achieve and how you can impact people. So I think both of those really resonate for me. And I think it's a beautiful note to kind of leave off this conversation on. So Rachel Taylor, really appreciate your time. And thank you guys for jumping on and sharing your inspiring impact thus far in your relatively young careers. Thank you guys.

Rachel Adams - Thank you so much.

Taylor Frey - Thanks for having us.